I'm ecstatic that we're getting a store!! (Uh oh.. is it a chain now?)

So let me get this straight. These arrogant capitalists have the nerve to sign a lease without consulting the community? The food at Harvest is very high priced. What about the low income residents of Forest Hills?

They should take customer service lessons from Whole Foods. I stopped going there years ago because I got so sick of the surly, rude service. I'd rather drive to WF in Dedham then go to Harvest. I can't wait until I can walk to WF in JP!!

Ha, this makes more sense than what the Harvest website says:

"a development near the Forest Hills T stop bordering Jamaica Plain and Hyde Park. "

I think that "development" is called Roslindale.

TOO EXPENSIVE

Chris, can you please give more information on the "Arboretum Project" and who the developer(s) is (or are) -- the BRA? A private developer? Thank you in advance!

Hi Jamaica Plainer, it is MBTA land, and the project is part of the Forest Hills Improvement Initiative through the BRA. It might be more complicated than that. Forest Hills neighbors (Ken Pope, I'm looking at you!) help me out if that's misleading.

WCI Corp purchased parcels V & W from the MBTA and the BRA facilitated the community planning process. Throughout the community process (2+ years that involved more than 10 community meetings) a grocery store often came up as a top priority. Once WCI was designed the developer they were very upfront in stating that they were trying to get a grocery store as the Parcel W anchor. At one of the community meetings (spring 2010?) they stated that they had hand delivered packets to all of the Boston grocery stores. WCI, which is based in JP (they own the JP Plaza on Amory St., 3313 Washington near Ruggerios, and the newish development on Amory-maybe 500 Amory). They've been very upfront in their plans. I think their website in www.wci-corp.com.

It amazes me that the Harvest Co-Op has lasted this long, never mind is opening another store nearby. Although I have been shopping there for years, it has only been for lack of a better alternative in the neighborhood. The majority of the fruit and veggies are always one day shy of rotten (I have purchased several onions, tomatoes, heads of garlic, etc. that were totally rotten on the inside); the store itself is often pretty dirty and sometimes downright dangerous (there was a huge leak in the roof for a long time, with live wires sticking out, while shoppers walked underneath); and the staff has often been shockingly rude. I am not alone in these observations - most people who have shopped there regularly just take these things as a given. WholeFoods can't get here soon enough.

I've had only good experiences with the staff at the Harvest. The physical plant, as jbaron points out, is another story. I hope that Harvest raising the capital to expand means they're also going to invest in some more reliable refrigeration units, which would seem to be a necessity for a grocery store.

Ughhhh. As someone who lives in the Bourne area and already suffers frequent 20-minute ordeals just to get from one end of Forest Hills station to the other, this news is the nail in the coffin..... There has been NO planning for the new traffic that these retail spaces are going to generate in an area that is already unbelievably congested. And oh yeah, they're also talking about taking down the Casey Overpass and delivering the thousands of cars that go over it each day onto the surface streets around Forest Hills. Brilliant.
It seems to me, that when asked about this new and overwhelming traffic situation, the current crop of city planners seems to respond with variations of the "if the traffic is bad, people will stop driving cars" meme..... I'm betting aainst that. And voting, as they say, with my feet. There will be a "for sale" sign in front of my house in the near future.

Why didn't the JPNC protest this high priced store? How suspicious is this? It is all starting to make sense now.....WF signs lease, City Feed and Harvest protest, Harvest opens new store. Of course Harvest and City Feed don't want Whole Foods here...they would rather have a monopoly on extremly overpriced food and surly employees. My daughter lives near Forest Hills and she can't wait for Whole Foods to open. I always thought City Feed and Harvest were behind all these protests.....now we know.

Chris, thanks for the response. As a Harvest member, I'm wondering how Harvest is financing these two expansion projects in Fenway and Forest Hills -- private bank loans, public subsidies, or member investment?

Thanks for updating this article with the quotes from Mr. St. Clair. I admit that when I read the original version of this story I thought it would be highly unlikely that they would keep the current JP location open with another, larger one opening down the street. I still have my doubts about it, to be honest. I've been a Harvest member for over 10 years and one of the biggest issues I know they struggle with is the physical limitations of the current JP store. I'd also like to agree with Eric, above, that Harvest has not publicly opposed Whole Foods at all. Their Cambridge store is in competition with TWO Whole Foods locations and still thrives.

Has anyone else noticed the nature of the tensions taking place? We're having a conversation about small business, large business, cost of food, and community services. Small business don't have the same kind of buying power that large businesses do, and so their prices are usually a little bit higher on some items. On the other hand, small businesses also work really hard to serve the needs of the community around them and to keep the prices low.

I tend to shop at different places throughout the week because I pick things up where they cost less. Cost depends on what you're buying. If you're purchasing beans and rice or other foods from the bulk bins, Harvest's prices are hard to beat. Their milk, soymilk, and eggs are cheaper than Whole Foods and comparable with Shaws (dairy is usually served by local vendors). Their produce is also comparable with Shaws. If you're buying a lot of packaged stuff, then, yes it's going to be more expensive because they're smaller and dealing with national, rather than local, vendors. And their prices knock the socks off City Feed, where I usually can't bring myself to buy anything because of the cost (sorry).

As far as Whole Foods is concerned, yes, their produce costs an arm and a leg, but it also lasts a heck of a lot longer. I rarely have produce from Whole Foods go bad in my fridge, which is more than I can say for any other store anywhere. Considering how much I hate throwing food and money away, that's real savings, too.

T_R- Thanks for your reply- I feel so much better now!! Just get rid of me and all of the other dinosaurs who still DRIVE!!!! Way to social engineer! Forget about all of my other qualities, be happy that I, a 25-year Bourne Street resident, am leaving the neighborhood based solely on the fact that I still need a car. It takes me 40 minutes to get to work driving, even with the accursed Forest HIlls blockage. The fastest I can get to work by public transportation is an hour and a half.
Even if I leave, there's still going to be mind-numbing traffic sitting at Forest Hills station, belching pollution into the air, because the traffic "planners" aren't paying attention to the effects of all of the potential new construction and Casey Overpass removal will have on the neighborhood.
Though all is not bad- I certainly have come to love Roslindale!! I rarely go into Jamaica Plain anymore, due to the hassle getting there. Turn left instead of right at the bottom of Walk Hill and in moments I'm in lovely Roslindale Center.

When people get old, it becomes more difficult for them to get around on foot, so they are more likely to drive places instead of walking there or taking public transportation. If people aren't old yet, but have physical limitations, it is also easier for them to drive to their destinations. I don't see any interest in those people in this effort to use physical and social engineering to reduce car usage. So in those neighborhoods that have been engineered into more walking, what happens to the old people? I know--who really cares about old people anyway? But there are a lot of us. Maybe we are expected to move away once biking and walking are too difficult. Or maybe just kill ourselves--who wants to look at old people, anyway? Ew.

A couple of points. One is that we've had decades of physical and social engineering to increase car usage. This is what road widening is all about. And it has worked very well. To the point that the roadways are clogged with able-bodied people who do have other transportation options. I don't think anyone thinks no 0ne should drive ever. But if more people who are able to walk to a local store or ride a bike or take a bus or a train start doing so, there will be less traffic impeding the travel of people who, due to physical limitations, have to drive.

Finally, people get old in countries all over the world where car ownership isn't as prevalent as it is here, which suggests that it's possible to get old without driving everywhere all the time.

@Boz, I agree. The US was built on the auto. compare our suburban sprawl with Europe. We have large housing developments in the suburbs with no stores or shops within walking distance. In most places I have been in Europe you may live far away from the town center but there is usually a couple shops within walking distance to get milk, eggs, bread, etc. Maybe even a local pub or two. I know that is not the case everywhere but the USA being such a comparatively young country with historically low fuel prices there was no incentive or reason to build urban sprawl differently. This way of thinking has not been lost in the city now. I know lots of people who live in JP, Roslindale, Brookline, etc who work near me in the Medical area and choose to drive for their own personal reasons. More reason to fund better public transport!

Living in the City we do have options and while I can't stand the 39 bus sometimes and would love to drive to work I try to drive locally as infrequently as possible. More shopping options in JP will allow me to drive even less locally.... Not sure where I am going with all this so enough typing ;-)

Getting back on topic here, I found the web site of the developer for these parcels: http://wci-realty.com/
They have PDFs of plans and architectural sketches of what the buildings may look like. I wish all the developers in the neighborhood provided this level of detail on their web sites!

Traffic resulting from overdevelopement of these parcels is very much on topic here, Rik! And as long as we're discussing our wishes, I wish that the MBTA would leave the green space GREEN!!! How's that for better quality of life?

As a resident of the Bourne area, I am a little taken aback by the cavalier attitude of some of the comments. A grocery store moves into Hyde Square, and it is possibly disruptive to the residents’ life. They get a whole organization with a fancy web site coming to their defense. A grocery store moves into the Bourne, and because of the traffic, it could be disruptive to our way of life. We are told – tough luck. Move.

Really? What gives? Why are our concerns not taken seriously? The traffic at the Walk Hill intersection is horrific right now. And the parcels that are being proposed for development are so small, I honestly don’t see how any development makes sense. I agree with the poster who said the green space should be kept green.

I'm excited about the development of these vacant parcels. Turning mostly unused land (I've never seen anyone on Parcel W and the random dog walker on the parcel across from Walk Hill) into active use is a great thing for the community. Bringing life to these vacant stretches will allow for a much safer commute for residents who walk that way especially during evening hours, local businesses will be able to thrive, and residents will be able to live right next to a major transit hub. I think we can work with the city, BRA, our elected officials, and the developers to make sure this can happen AND that it addresses the traffic concerns.

I somehow am not thrilled when I think of the city, the BRA, our elected officials and developers coming together to build out these parcels. I tend to think we end up with the lowest common denominator. And just because we aren't all "using" the greenspace, doesn't mean it has no value. Space. Just by itself. What a wonderful thing.
No matter. The developments will come and the congestion will be a nightmare. And some of us will move, with sadness, somewhere else.

@Dougie M - The BRA was not very pro-active when dealing with traffic issues with the FHII - I'm not certain why you think things would suddenly be so different now? Also - I'm not sure what vacant stretches you walk by if you live on Tower St... or is your concern for others who may (or may not) have that fear. Where some revel in nature - others see 'dangerous vacant parcels'. I do remember that you wanted maximum density for the FHII, plus maxium units of Low Income Housing.... to my 'home owner' ears that does NOT increase desirability for a neighborhood.
I think we, as a neighborhood, should keep our focus on keeping that area across from Dunkin D green! This neighborhood is going to see some MAJOR changes now that the parcels down Washington St. are being developed. We also have to remember that there are proposals for more development where the old oil tanks were, and at the Fitzpatrick parking lot....

With the renewed and increased interest in gardening, maybe some of the parcels could be converted into gardening plots for neighbors. From what I know, many of the neighborhood garden plots in JP had a long wait-list last year.

As I've stated in other forums, I am pretty excited about having a decent, natural foods-based grocery within easy walking distance of my house! I am concerned about the possibility of traffic increases, but additional parking and smart pedestrian solutions (an overpass?) might alleviate some of that.

I would love, however, to keep from seeing too much development of dense residential (particularly rental) units. I would not mind seeing more affordable housing that is for ownership rather than rental, giving the new owners more investment in the community. It feels as if rental properties do not instill the same sort of community spirit, and lead to a less integrated and more transient population. Pride of place comes from investment in a place; rental properties inspire less of that community investment.

Looking at the meeting notes it appears that there has already been a tremendous amount of back and forth on the future of these parcels and eventual compromise on the final vision and priorities. and some significant compromises on both ends of the spectrum especially about the number of homes. The characterization of renters is a myth and pitting renters against homeowners is unfair. Sure, college students and young professionals move around a lot but older adults, even renters in affordable housing, tend to establish deep roots in their community and many are involved in community activities. We should focus our energy on welcoming anyone who wants to move into the community.