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An Open Letter to Jamaica Plain on "The Whole Foods Effect"
In contrast, there's "The Jamaica Plain Effect" – the impact of a powerful, loving, grassroots community taking ownership of itself.
Blue flyers for opponents of the proposed Whole Foods in Jamaica Plain were handed out in both English and Spanish.
Photos (8)
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Videos (1)
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Pdfs (2)
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Dear Neighbors,
I have been listening deeply to the heated controversy incited by the news that Whole Foods' plans to open a new store in Hyde Square, the Latin Quarter of our neighborhood.
The lively debate of the past few weeks has inspired me to learn more, to research more, and to better understand the extent to which the arrival of a Whole Foods Market should be expected to contribute to gentrification in Jamaica Plain.
What I’ve learned is that for years journalists, real-estate agents, developers, and city planning consultants around the country have been discussing a phenomenon called “The Whole Foods Effect." It refers to the impact of a Whole Foods store on the value of surrounding real-estate and its magnet-like tendency to draw other upscale stores.
The Whole Foods Effect, I’ve learned, has been known to dramatically accelerate the process of gentrification. Perhaps the most well-known commenter on this subject is the CEO of Whole Foods himself, John Mackey, who in a 2007 CNNmoney.com article said, "The joke is that we could have made a lot more money just buying up real estate around our stores and developing it than we could make selling groceries."
While Mackey’s comment is both revealing and demonstrates a lack of concern about the role his company plays in the gentrification of neighborhoods, he is hardly the only person to point out this connection. Greg Badishkanian, an analyst with Citigroup who tracks Whole Foods, said in a 2006 NPR story, "When Whole Foods opens up a store in a particular market, all of the real estate in the area gets a nice uplift. It could be a few percent to 10, 15, 20 percent in terms of the real estate value."
Realtors, too, have been saying it for years. For example, in Southern California, real estate agent Phillipe Rodrigue blogged in 2010, "one way to instantly increase property values is to have a big, beautiful Whole Foods Market open up right in your neighborhood!"
Much like Rodrigue, a Chicago realtor named Brett Hutchins wanted to buy a condo near a new Whole Foods in Sarasota, saying, 'I know what happens to real-estate values when Whole Foods goes in.'"
Even a 2007 study in Portland, Ore. found that property values typically go up byabout 17.5 percent if you live nearby a Whole Foods. [The study, “An Assessment of the Marginal Impact of Urban Amenities on Residential Pricing,” is attached at right as a PDF.]
But out of all of the communities hit by the Whole Foods Effect, the Ward 2 neighborhood in Washington, D.C. is interestingly analogous to Boston’s Latin Quarter.
Ten years ago, at the turn of the century, D.C.’s Ward 2 went through a similar grocery store turnover during a major shift in its population and income. The parallels portend the risks that Hyde Square faces in welcoming a Whole Foods Market.
Neighborhoods in Transition
First of all, when the P Street Whole Foods opened in Ward 2, it replaced a more affordable grocery store (across the street). [See attached PDF at right, "The Impact of Whole Foods on the 14th St. and Greater Logan Circle Area."]
Hyde Square’s affordable grocery store, Hi-Lo (arguably the most affordable grocer in Jamaica Plain), is set to be replaced by Whole Foods. So, in both communities, we see the transformation of an accessible grocery store to an upscale one.
Secondly, both neighborhoods were inhabited primarily by people of color and then saw these populations leave in large numbers during the ten years prior to catching the attention of Whole Foods. In the decade prior to Whole Foods’ new P Street store inWard 2, the neighborhood’s African American population had declined by 23 percent. [also according to "The Impact of Whole Foods," attached.] In Hyde Square, the percentage of residents of Latin American descent has declined 26 percent from 2000 to 2009, according to the Census Bureau's American Community Survey.
Thirdly, as the racial makeup changed in each area, so did the income levels. The Jamaica Plain neighborhood experienced a roughly 20 percent increase in income in the last ten years, as did Ward 2 before the arrival of Whole Foods, according to Onboard LLC.
These similarities give us reason to look closely at what happened in Ward 2. There, the arrival of Whole Foods was the “watershed event” in the neighborhood’s gentrification. Clearly, it didn’t start the process, but it did cause its acceleration.
Turning up the Heat
Even the Community Liaison for the P Street Whole Foods, Zachary Stein, acknowledged it in a Public Radio Exchange piece: “How do I see our store as part of the gentrification? The newer residents wanted us to come, so we came and we catered to the newer residents…While we didn’t cause it, it was already happening before we got here…it was well on it’s way by the time we showed up, but I guess we sort of helped the process along.”
In that same Public Radio Exchange piece, a group of 8th-graders took their mics out on the streets of Ward 2 and recorded people’s views on the gentrifying impact of Whole Foods. Everyone seemed to acknowledge, as one person put it, “[Whole Foods] didn’t start the gentrification, but it definitely helped it.”
Another said, “Anytime you see a Whole Foods, you know that’s gonna be a new neighborhood. If a Whole Foods goes into a neighborhood, then you know that neighborhood’s changing."
It “made a statement that this was going to be an area for wealthier shoppers,” according to the Degan and Haber P Street study [attached as PDF.]
The P Street study concluded, “the appearance of Whole Foods has dramatically increased the speed of gentrification in the area” – beyond the speed of grassroots checks and balances.
Walking through Ward 2, you’ll now see new condos, new niche stores for the wealthy, higher-end chain stores, older businesses that have had to adapt to survive, and new businesses that replaced the ones that didn’t (or couldn’t) adapt. Property values have escalated – the home of Wayne Dickson, who lobbied for the P Street Whole Foods, was worth $230,000 in 1986 and is now assessed at $1.6 million (Dickson understood the Whole Foods Effect before it even hit Ward 2, as evidenced in this Washinton Post piece.)
The most poignant observation of the damage done by the Whole Foods Effect ironically comes from Mr. Dickson, "We're losing a great number of our poorer neighbors and our African American neighbors. Today there are only two remaining African American families on this block. There have been people who have cashed out, who have done very, very well -- but! They won't ever get back in."
Some pre-existing residents may experience some specific benefits from some specific aspects of The Whole Foods Effect. But overall, we see the faces of neighborhoods changing. As Fran Robertson, a long-time D.C. resident, put it in talking to the Washington Post, "A lot of the blacks are having to move because they can't afford to stay here. These are people who have owned their own homes but have had to leave because the taxes are going up. The affluent is coming in, and the have-nots are moving out, and it's not right."
Renters beholden to the private market are also displaced, not by “cashing out”, but by being priced out. So the face of a neighborhood changes as the door is shut and locked behind them, likely much quicker if you add The Whole Foods Effect.
Does Hyde Square want to live through the Whole Foods Effect much like Ward 2? What does Hyde Square want to look like in 10 years?
The Jamaica Plain Effect
As the shadow of Whole Foods blankets Boston’s Latin Quarter, the corporation is seeing something they’ve probably never seen before – a very large and well-organized group ofneighbors rising out of their armchairs, shutting their laptops, sweeping up their children and gathering at public rallies and forums, demanding an affordable and diverse Jamaica Plain without Whole Foods. They’ve launched a campaign called “Whose Foods?”, collected hundreds of petition signatures, spoken out to the Neighborhood Council, produced four videos, garnered the attention of major papers and blogs, gathered over 400 Facebook fans, written letters-to-editors, and created a bilingual Web site that even nay-sayers are calling “very slick” -- all in a handful of weeks.
I imagine that Whole Foods assumed Hyde Square would give ground in much the sameway as Ward 2. But Jamaica Plainers are unusual – not only have residents here successfully kept out Dominos, Jack-in-the-Box, K-Mart, and a state highway, but there are also some truly meaningful and rich ties between neighbors across race and class that have quickly woven a network of resistance. This is the Jamaica Plain Effect – the impact of a powerful, loving, grassroots community taking ownership of itself.
I stand with everyone who is opposed to a Whole Foods in Hyde Square. With hope and faith, I ask my neighbors to join me.
Helen Matthews
Atherton Street
Jamaica Plain resident since 2002
[Editor's note: I've replaced the writer's original footnotes with links and the two attached PDFs at the right of studies she cites. I thought that would be easier to follow.]
Thanks. We'll email you the next time we update this story.
Rick S
12:15 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
Very nicely articulated, but it does not change the fact that Boston's Latin Quarter missed an opportunity to make itself a strong and viable destination as a Latin Quarter. Had the neighborhood not been content to just call itself the Latin Quarter for the sheer number of Latinos that lived here perhaps there would have been a strategic plan in place to market existing and secure new businesses that would have created a thriving Latin Quarter - much like the oft-compared North End.
And as someone intimately familiar with the supermarket industry I would not go so far as to give yourselves the credit for which you seem to be taking for your movement against Whole Foods. There is always opposition to change and I don't think there is anyone at Whole Foods or in this neighborhood that has actually been caught off guard by any of this. The most surprising thing is the wasted time and energy that continues to go into taking down Whole Foods for the sake of adding it to a list of "accomplishments" and not to finding a solution that will actually address the needs of the entire community - not just the side you agree with.
JPneighbor
12:16 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
What an outstanding and beautiful article. Well-written, balanced, and well-researched. Thank you for your input and for highlighting a situation that clearly forebodes the potential impact of Whole Foods on JP. My concern is not for the JP of next year, but the JP of ten years from now. I would hate to see JP become just another suburb - as homogeneous as Whole Foods itself - rather than the unique and diverse neighborhood with an extraordinary sense of community that it has been for so long. You can find Whole Foods (and gentrified neighborhoods) anywhere, but it is much rarer and more precious to find and preserve a community that insists on local business, on affordability, on mutual accountability, and on co-existence among people of various races, cultures, ethnicities, food preferences and incomes.
Ben Mauer
12:29 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
@JPneighbor I really appreciate your comment. "My concern is not for the JP of next year, but the JP of ten years from now." and "You can find Whole Foods (and gentrified neighborhoods) anywhere." These are statements that I feel represent my sentiments exactly. Those decrying empty storefronts (of which there are not that many), seem to be focused only on next year. I don't know about those folks, but I want to be a part of JP for as long as I can afford to live nearby and as long as it remains vibrant, unique, and diverse.
Let's stop thinking about the big bucks all the real estate people can make if they flip all these houses in the next year if Whole Foods moves in, and start thinking about JP in 10, 20 years.
Ben Mauer
12:17 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
Amen! I've had an intuition and a few facts about how a Whole Foods coming in, if it does, would really accelerate increase in property values and displacement of low- and moderate-income folks, but these quotes make the impact crystal clear.
What blows my mind from the evidence of this letter is that moderate-income residents, even if they are homeowners, could be priced out or feel pressure to move out of the neighborhood. "They won't ever get back in." That's what we're talking about -- the acceleration not of good change or development but of irreversible and rending change. "They won't ever get back in." I want my community to be diverse and affordable. I want my community and its rate of change to lift up the least of us, and the small business owners to make this place great rather than displacing them.
What I would like to see is Whole Foods to take responsibility for already dividing our community in its quest for potential profits. And I would like to see this community rally around the many walkable and bike-able alternatives to Whole Foods we have in front of us: CSA's, Farmers Markets, City Feed, Harvest; as well as rally for the many affordable options that will sustain our neighborhood rather than divide it and rip it apart.
Thanks Helen for your thoughtful research that confirms what I already felt: we are facing a watershed moment in our neighborhood, and all who care about justice for low- and moderate-income homeowners and renters needs to step up.
Rick S
12:23 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
you forgot to mention that "They won't ever get back in" is preceded by "There have been people who have cashed out, who have done very, very well".
Mondo Punto Azul Blanco Naranja
11:57 am on Thursday, April 14, 2011
Whole foods is going to do for JP what 30 years of misguided 'affordable' development programs could not do: Bring jobs and opportunity to JP. Instead you had the JPNDC screwing around with housing and development, shoe-horning in permanent subsidies of all kinds for people who need "community support" (welfare) in order to hang in JP. The times they are a changin' and we should be welcoming WF, not tormenting them with more idealogical garbage. The only people who should 'take responsibility' for dividing the 'community' is the letter writer and her group who seeks to control things they don't own and people who don't think like you do.
Ben Mauer
12:22 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
Also, thanks Chris Helms for seeking balance on this issue. I appreciate that you've posted this letter with equivalent prominence to the two previous "pro Whole Foods" letters.
Eric
12:30 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
One thing this does not take into consideration is the current and future real estate markets because of the collapse of those markets. It is entirely possible that home prices will remain stagnant or continue to decrease for reasons largely outside of anything like Whole Foods. All of thee studies deal with a very different time.
Rira
12:37 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
PUBLIC POLICY 101:
As so many have already said Whole Food does not bring gentrification, whole foods is the result of it. More to the point - politicians WANT economic revitalization and fight for it decades before we even see it. JP's economic vitality started 20 and 30 years ago with neighborhood activists lobbying city, state and federal government to improve JP. Subway lines, job creation, better crime fighting, arson control, grafitti removal in 24 hours, better schools, youth jobs, better lighting, better T and bus service, improved streetscape, etc. People feeling safe in their neighborhoods raises property values and rents in a matter of months, 1 rent cycle! Politicians AND residents alike both want these improvements. and yes, politicians WANT property values to rise - higher values mean more revenue for the ever increasing demands on city , state and local government for critical services. If a politician tells you they want lower property values, they are not being honest with you. Go to a public policy meeting - any meeting - pick one, city, state, federal - you will see 1st hand - your elected representatives want to improve your lives, brings jobs to their district, and yes raise property values in their district to raise tax revenue - so they can say yes when people ask for services of all kinds.
If you want to stop gentrification - you need to be there before it starts.
Rira
12:38 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
Gentrification starts 20, 30 even 50 years prior to when we see it on the retail level.
The gentrification ship has sailed from JP. But the opportunity exists now for you in Dudley.
In today's Globe, Mayor Menino just announced a $115 million funding initiative to renovate (yes gentrify) the Ferdinand building. That will raise property values in Dudley stratospherically - fast! It will displace 1,000's in the years to come. Whole Foods will then come to Dudley in 20 years, along with starbucks and doggy daycare. The opportunity is yours now to stop this. Rally and protest now to keep Dudley affordable by blocking the mayor's and all local, state and federal politician's from supporting the revitalization of Dudley and job creation in that district. If you mean what you say - you can make that difference you are talking about - quite seriously. If you do not mean what you say, keep "fighting" the ghost in JP and ignore the very real difference you can make in Dudley.
Ben Mauer
12:52 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
@Rira, we don't live in Dudley. We live in JP. Dudley is not our neighborhood, JP is. I am not some dislocated white hipster who travels to the next "authentic" neighborhood when mine gets too expensive or "not diverse enough," or who fights fights for other people or other neighborhoods -- I've been living and/or working in JP for 10 years -- and I want JP to be good for everybody.
We can have a sustainable level of development in JP. There is no writing on the wall. No ship has sailed except your own ship of cynicism and lack of imagination. Nothing is inevitable. I will fight for my neighborhood. I will not give up. Because sustainable, balanced change does not happen because the "market" wants it. I happens because people from all walks of life who actually care about living in a neighborhood that isn't filled with 2000 you's work for local, affordable, and creative alternatives to "just add water" chains.
Ben Mauer
12:58 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
And if there are people reading this who care about living in a diverse neighborhood like me, whether you're rich, middle-class, poor, white, black, Latino gay, straight go to
http://whosefoods.org/petition
and sign the petition in support of an affordable and diverse JP and against a Whole Foods in Jamaica Plain.
Shawn F.
6:14 pm on Sunday, March 6, 2011
I would not classify WF as just another "just add water" chain.... How many stores in JP will donate the amount WF will to local charity. We already lost the best neighborhood supporter we had when Bella Luna was force to leave... CVS, 7-11, and the worst of them Rent-a-Center are just add water chains, along with Jack in the box and dominos stated above... These two offer extremely unhealthy low priced food and prey on poorer residents. I don't see anyone picketing Rent-a-Center who prey on the poorer people wherever they open. I leave out Dunkins because they donate a lot of money to local charity.
Also, I don't care what some studies say, you can present the same data from two sides and make it work.... WF does not cause gentrification and higher housing prices, they are seeing a trend and opening a store where demand is already located. If they don't move in, the neighborhood will continue to "gentrify" and housing prices will continue to rise. People are moving away from the explosion of suburbia from the 1950s and the utter reliance on the automobile and realizing that there are many benefits as well as costs to living IN the city they work in. MarkBoston below, good points and I agree this has more benefits than minuses for the neighborhood.
MarkBoston
12:56 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
how about the Latino home owners who live near by ? If and I say 'if" .. the magic powers of having Whole Foods opening in the area raises home values .. I would think it's insulting to suggest that the Latin community should not want what the rest of of Anglo home owners want ... The value of our property to improve .. even in today's horrible downturn we all pray that we dont get to having upside down mortgages where we loose value ...
They need to build the equity in their homes just as everyone else does.. For most , it's our money to retire on. Whole Foods could be a great jump start of new investments in the area ( I live 2 blocks from the new site as well ) . EVERYONE in every community wants to have a chance to have better & more secure lives. More investments in the area brings new jobs.. WHY do people believe that keeping a neighborhood stagnant and poor , a good thing ??
Rira
1:07 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
KNAPP'S OTHER VACANT STORE IN CHESTNUT HILL
A moment to reflect - as difficult as this is for so many, the loss of a cultural icon, despite how sinfully the Knapps treated their workers, and the loss of an opportunity for affordable and interesting foods - JP has changed over the past 20 years, sales were down and the Knapps chose to retire.
So here we all at a very visible pivoting point. We all have a vacant store in Hyde sq. that fact might not change for 5 or 1o years as is the case with the "Omni" food store the Knapps closed on route 9 in Chest Nut Hill 15 years ago that is still a vacant scar on Chestnut Hill. The Knapps have not cared about Chestnut Hill for 15 years and wont care about JP for 15 years to come. So if this 'whose foods' groups succeeds in scaring off W F, we may suffer the same fate as Chestnut Hill. That stretch of route 9 is the pride of no one and more importantly the site of zero jobs.
Paul
2:10 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
This is Whole Issue is ridiculous. It's a fight for fight's sake. The Whole Foods is going to be better for our community in general, and this article doesn't convince me otherwise. I like the comments left by Rick S., Mark Boston and Rira (except I do find the Dudley comment to be irrelevant).
In any case, this is not worth my time. I'm excited for the Whole Foods!
Where was this passion when Agassiz school was considering closing its doors. Not a single comment on this article ...
http://jamaicaplain.patch.com/articles/parents-and-teachers-speak-against-closing-the-agassiz-school
Michael
9:45 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
POW! Because, like expensive Harvest Co-Op, or City Feed & Supply, it's not in the "Latin Quarter". Let's call it the NIMBY effect.
gretchen van ness
2:58 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
I have a lot more faith in JP and my neighbors than the Whose Foods people do. Nothing about having a WF in Hyde Square is going to stop all the work that continues to protect affordable housing in JP, to support local businesses, to celebrate our diverse culture, to enable "regular" people to make our homes here, to continue the fight for jobs and for economic, political, social and environmental justice, and to be welcoming to all people.
Rira
4:37 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
One piece is that is missing are the 1,000's of opinions from those families of color who bought homes decades ago and have benefited from gentrification in a very real way when they sold their homes at a profit. Homes that they bought and fixed up, yes that families of color fixed up themselves, that they themselves "gentrified" and have said so on the various web pages .
Of course many of them have not commented since they are not here in JP to do so - but surely would since they are very thankful for what they received . They worked hard fixing up their homes many not even speaking English, but they knew that hard work would pay off for them, and it did. They were patient and as time went on, and they fixed their homes up more each year their property values went up and they were able to sell their homes and profit and at the same show the next generation that hard work and patience pays off - no better example to youth than to show by doing - and they did and they were, and are proud of what they accomplished. Some of those members of the Latin American community moved to warm and sunnier climates in the US and some moved back to their countries of origin to enjoy comfortable retirements while helping out their families who stayed back here, help that they could not have provided had that they not sold their homes at a profit.
And those here opposed to gentrification would deny those hard working families of color their piece of the American dream - how unfair.
Ben Mauer
9:19 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
Unfortunately @Rira, you are not the voice of all those Latin American folks, and your attempt to speak for them strikes me as highly stereotyping. I'm sorry if I've made an assumption and you're Latin American, but your use of "they" and "those" and "their" suggests you are not Latin American and are only conjecturing about what "they" have done or want. I only speak for myself in this forum. I am a moderate income white male and I would also like to live in JP in 5 years.
Deselby
11:16 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
Ben, you are not the voice of Latin American folks, either. In fact it seem a large part of the "Whose Foods" opponents are young white hipsters, whose guilt at growing up middle class in the suburbs may be haunting them.
Also, you mentioned Dudley Street. JP will always be diverse, for no other reason that Bromley Heath housing project and other subsidized housing. But if that is not enough for you, you could move to Dorchester, Roxbury or Chelsea and perhaps find your perfect ethnic balance - less middle to upper-middle income people.
Jonathan
8:57 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
No matter how much evidence you can come up with to counter any claims that a whole foods in any neighborhood is bad for the neighborhood, you can not prove that it does not lead to/increase the further displacement of low income residents via the process of gentrification. John Mckay does not care about Jamaica Plain...he cares about his bank account. This is what multinational corporations are famous for. They are homogenizing machines. We don't need 20 whole foods within a 20 mile radius.
Bob from JP
9:56 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
Why is gentrification so evil and bad? Is it because it makes neighborhoods safer? Cleaner? More desirable to "outsiders"? Because it rewards people who had the foresight to invest their money in real estate?
Why do renters and low income residents "deserve" to live in JP any more than home and condo owners? Is it because they were here first? Have they laid some claim to the land that is irrevocable?
I'd love to live in Newton, but I can't afford it. Should I start a protest and insist that they kick all the rich residents out and move in a multicultural population of low to moderate income residents? No, if I want to live in Newton, I should put my nose to the grindstone, work hard, and make enough money to move there. If I can't do it, I can't do it. That's reality.
Bob from JP
9:48 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
Last time I checked, despite the fact that we are in Massachusetts, we still live in the USA, where capitalism is the predominant economic system. No one put a gun to the Knapp's heads and forced them to lease the building to Whole Foods. It's called FREE MARKET CAPITALISM and it's what built this country. Let it work in JP.
Aside from the clear communist/socialist leanings of this activism, the hypocrisy inherent in the anti-WF "movement" is best reflected in the comments made by one of its leaders at a recent meeting.
" Jamaica Plain is for us, not for the rich people." - Betsaida Gutiérrez
Not only do these people want to dictate which businesses can operate in JP, they now want to dictate WHO CAN LIVE HERE!
White "Yuppies" and others making more than 80% of median AGI are not welcome in JP apparently - but they are welcome to continue paying the taxes that FUND the JPNDC, food stamp programs and other forms of social aid that poorer JP residents gladly receive.
Back to reality people. Snap out of your fantasy world.
Deselby
11:29 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
I believe a lot of the opposition has been encouraged by Rep. Sanchez and Councillor Arroyo, who want to preserve their electoral base. Rep, Sanchez in particular is a hypocrite - he moved from Armstrong Street in the Hyde/Jackson Square end of his district, to tony Moss Hill on the far other end.
In other words, gentrification for me, but not for thee. Sanchez didn't like living in the "Latin Quarter," but wants to keep a base of voters who won't look past his last name when he faces the inevitable challenge.
Arroyo won't be one of my four votes this fall for at-large City Council. He'd rather pander to the nutbars than help provide 100 jobs for people in the neighborhood.
CN
1:00 pm on Tuesday, March 8, 2011
Bravo, JP! Well said.
" Jamaica Plain is for us, not for the rich people." - Betsaida Gutiérrez - Perhaps one of the most ridiculous quotes I have read throughout this whole debate!
Mondo Punto Azul Blanco Naranja
12:01 pm on Thursday, April 14, 2011
Well said. I am more concerned about creeping socialist attitudes than about WF.
Juli H.
9:51 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
@BenMauer, I am a Hyde Square small business owner. Are you? my landlady is Latina, and has owned the building and others since the 70s. She's told me stories of how it used to be in the 70s and 80s- that you "couldn't go out at night" and if something happened like a shooting (which happened often- her words) she would call the police MANY MANY times and they wouldn't come. She is OVERJOYED that Whole Foods is coming. What gives YOU the right to deny her the increase in property value, that she will have because she and her immigrant husband were smart enough to invest in the community back then? And I AM one of the small business owners in Hyde Square. If you "Whose Foods" people succeed in your misguided quest to keep Whole Foods away, it will be at the expense of the success of my business and others in Hyde Square. I will be so angry if that happens. Why not focus on things to keep the neighborhood diverse in other ways? Change always comes. And this one is really a blessing. You people who are fighting against it are deluded and need to stop "fighting." this is beyond ridiculous.
applemachine
11:18 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
so well-articulated JPsmallbusinessowner.
jljp
8:51 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
Couldn't agree more! An increase in foot traffic will help fill storefronts and foster healthy business competition that will create a more businesses that address the needs of all Hyde/Jackson Sq/ residents.
jljp
4:17 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
I've just joined a great new site petitioning a welcoming JP for ALL of use who live and work here! You may want to check it out:
www.jpforall.org
applemachine
11:10 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
JPSmallbusinessowner: God THANK YOU for writing that. This "battle" is so irritating. In so many ways, from so many angles.
But one thing I HAVE to comment on: Harvest and City Feed as "affordable alternatives" to Whole Foods? Come on. For real? This is such a vomit-sack of mixed up, self-righteous political agendas. A fight for fights' sake. I mean, I'm liberal, queer, pro-CSA, farmer's market pro-small business, a small business owner myself, yippidy doo, blah blah blah blah, but as far as affordable grocerystores, there's a Stop n Shop right in hyde square! And whole foods has healthy fresh food, whole, organic options that are more affordable (hello, 365 brand) than City Feed and and Harvest. I mean my god. This is so irritating. Whole Foods is not a bad monster. Get over it and rally about something else worthwhile.
Deselby
11:23 pm on Saturday, March 5, 2011
The opponents have no alternative. They equate diversity with impoverishment, so they prefer that the site remain empty and blighted. If 100 people in the neighborhood are denied jobs, so be it.
Michael Halle
12:47 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
Whether you support or don't support Whole Foods coming into Hyde Square, I think it's important not to gloss over the economic impact of the downturn for JP businesses, and those in the Hyde/Jackson in particular.
There are empty store fronts -- more empty store fronts than there were two years ago. Long-time beloved mainstays of the area have closed, been forced to curtail their hours, or moved. New businesses have emerged, but it's hard to imagine anyone's feeling comfortable. They need community support, and that primarily means one thing: not debate, but people spending money now.
The diversity these businesses represent, namely places where people of different backgrounds, classes, cultures, and colors can experience something totally new or culturally familiar to them as part of a larger supportive community, resonates with many people in JP. These businesses also directly or indirectly support the customers and employees most at risk during hard times.
Most business owners don't have the luxury of dwelling on who'll make money in the future of JP real estate, or what the neighborhood will look like 10 years from now, or even possibly one year from now. They may well be thinking about whether they'll be open next month, or who they have to lay off, or how they'll support their family.
Please debate diversity, gentrification, the current situation, and the future. Just try to do it while spending money today enjoying Hyde Square/Jackson/Egleston/JP Centre.
Rira
2:47 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
From WE ARE WHOLE FOODS:
call/email these people at Whole Foods to reinforce the fact that despite a few highly vocal critics, most of JP wants Whole Foods in our neighborhood:
■Whole Foods North Atlantic Regional Office
125 Cambridge Park Drive
Cambridge, MA 02140
...617.492.5500
617.492.5510 fax
■Laura Derba, Whole Foods President of North Atlantic Regional Office
617-492-5500
Laura.Derba@wholefoods.com
■Robin Rehfield, Whole Foods North Atlantic PR Manager
617-417-3895
Robin.Rehfield@wholefoods.com
■John Mackey, Whole Foods Chief Executive Officer (CEO)
John.Mackey@wholefoods.com
patty
7:33 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
I am an immigrant whose native language is not English who has lived in Jamaica Plain for over 50 years. I grew up in the Bromley Heath projects and through hard work and perserverance earned an academic scholarship to college. I went on to earn a Master's degree. By working two jobs I was able to buy a condo in Jamaica Plain and raise my kids in this wonderful, diverse neighborhood. Both of my children went to school in Roxbury and other local schools. I have always been a strong neighborhood advocate and remember well the violence in the 70's and 80's in the Hyde Square area. I have always tried to shop my own neighborhood but 20 years ago it was very unsafe to go to Hyde Square. This is now a great neighborhood but with the many empty storefronts there is a need for small businesses. I find this fight over a grocery store to be very disheartening. If you don't want to shop at Whole Foods then don't go there. Why not frequent the small bodegas who need your business and channel your anger on something more important like the closing of the Agassiz school or the potential closing of our libraries. I would think that the education of children and the ability of all residents to access library services might be more concerning than a grocery store. I find it very short sighted to think that the presence of a grocery store will have such a potential impact on real estate. I welcome Whole Foods and I have lived here probably longer than most of you.
jljp
8:48 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
Thank you Patty! Your story of hard work and responsibility is exactly what has helped clean Hyde/Jackson Square up! Instead of all of this nonsense bickering, energy should be focused on filling these vacant storefronts and ensuring that they neighborhood does not slip back to it's dismal state of the 80's.
Rira
12:19 pm on Sunday, March 6, 2011
Patty,
YOU have summed it all up. Period.
In my opinion, your 50 years starting in the Bromley Heath Project and lifting yourself up and lifting the next generation up speaks volumes AND you are FOR the Whole Foods. I'd like to hear a 'Whose Fooder' reply to you, directly. In fact, if you'd like to post this on the "Whose Fooder" facebook page, I think it would speak more volumes there - 10 times! Also, please call, write and fax Arroyo, Menino, Sanchez, O'Malley and Chang Diaz - they ALL need to hear your very personal story - your unique voice really matters. While all conversations should be about 1 voice = the same impact, in such things some voices speak 'louder' and in this case your voice has spoken one of the loudest so far, I'd say you are top 10! So keep on speaking - come to those cranky meetings that seem to go off into bizarre fantasy lands and tell your story- the long silent pause after you speak will be deafening - followed , by a slow, but very tangible reality that I believe might just start to sink into the hearts and minds of those 'whose fooders' who would deny you and so many others that better Hyde Square that you have succeeded in fighting for and for some mis guided reason they would send you ( and all 10,000 of us ) back to that violent Hyde Square that you fought to leave 20 and 30 years ago that they never even knew!
jljp
4:18 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
I've just joined a great new site petitioning a welcoming JP for ALL of use who live and work here! You may want to check it out:
www.jpforall.org
Boz
8:37 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
Helen: Since you've lived in JP since 2002, I thought I would share some local history with you.
When I moved to JP in 1993, there was an independent grocer at the corner of Centre and Moraine. It was called Flanagan's, and the working-class Irish people in the neighborhood used to shop there. Prices were high and quality was low, but it, along with the Hi-Lo, was the only game in town. Until a chain store came to Jackson Square and built a large store right next to the projects. Flanagan's couldn't compete and shut down. It was replaced by CVS.
On Centre Street, there was an independent drug store called Hailer's at the corner of Centre and Seaverns. There was also Kennedy Butter & Egg in the spot where there is currently a Verizon Store. There was a Woolworth's in the current site of the Goodwill store. Later,there was a locally-owned used record store called Hi-Fi where the dentist's office is at St. John and Centre. And on Boylston Street, there was an affordable convenience store where the chain-smoking owners would greet you sullenly if at all while they watched TV. When one of the owners died, an upscale, unaffordable store that catered to a different class of people opened up in its place. That was City Feed and Supply.
All this stuff happened before you lived here. Some changes were decried, others ignored, but JP remained the neighborhood you came to love. Please please devote your community organizing energy to something that actually matters.
patty
8:52 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
Before Flanagans it was the A and P and there was a pharmacy next door with lunch counter where I worked all through high school. There was a Publix Market where Tedeschi's on Centre Street is located. There was Smith Pharmacy where Bon Savor is and they really had penny candy that was a penny. The Children's Museum was located on Burroughs Street and I spent many a happy afternoon there as a junior curator and at day camp when it was called the July Jaunters. The Stop and Shop is the second one that is there as there was one in the 60's when we lived in Bromley Heath. There was a bakery where Real Deal is located. Change is part of life and the neighborhood has retained its diversity overf the years. Twenty years from now my kids might write "There was once a Hi Lo where Whole Foods is". As I stated above if you don't want to shop at Whole Foods then don't. There are other shopping alternatives in the area. Again as stated use your energy to save our librairies which is a far greater concern as persons depend on the library for information, entertainment, internet and peace and quiet.
Michael
10:23 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
I've lived in JP for 19 years and have seen the "gentrification" at work, and have been personally impacted by it. Hailer's was still open, Kennedy's Butter & Eggs, Today's Bread in the space Bukhara occupies. There used to be a farm stand we bought produce and our Christmas trees at in a shack on the corner of Burroughs and Centre. There was a gallery and art center in the Firehouse where JP Licks thrives. So much change.
I lived for 15 years in one of the three homes at the Monument which were sold to a developer by way of a sealed bid process in 2007. Having saved my money, I did my homework, hired an appraiser, looked at comps and income approach, and I tried to purchase the run down 2 family I was in. I was SQUASHED by a developer by $100,000! Summarily evicted, I had 60 days to vacate after 15 years residency. No one cried a tear for me or my low income neighbors. No one protested the condo-ization of our affordable homes. No articles in the JP Gazette. No WHOSE HOMES websites. Wrong neighborhood I guess.
Change happens. Deal.
Bring WFM to Parkside/Forest Hills. I want healthy, affordable food within walking distance of my new neighborhood. This area needs gentrification. Bring it. Please.
patty
10:38 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
I agree totally. I remember well the condo craze and my mother and grandmother were forced out then. I did not see protesters either when my then blind 75 year old grandmother had to find a new home. Jamaica Plain is a large community and encompasses a large array of ethnic, cultural and racial types of people. It is not JUST a Latin neighborhood and the grocery store will be for all. One grocery store does not cause gentrification. I think these protesters would rather have their petitions and angry rhetoric than to come up with a solution. Would people rather see an empty store and blighted parking lot? The block where Bella Luna was is empty except for the hair salon. Why don't these protesters find some renters for those empty spaces or if they are all so gung ho on Whole Foods not opening there ,then team up , buy the space and open your own grocery store and run it better than Hi Lo did.
Lesia Stanchak
10:28 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
Real estate is not the hot commodity it once was...he should have taken that in consideration when writing his article. Why is it that nobody stirred when Bella Luna lost their lease to a shark like Mordechai Levin who raises the rents to the point they are unaffordable. This leaves the property empty for extended periods. How good is that for the community????
Rira
1:19 pm on Sunday, March 6, 2011
BELLA LUNA / MILKY WAY VACANCY - THE REAL ISSUE:
From what I hear not only is he greedy and shortsighted, he suffers from sour personality disorder. THAT is the primary issue and why the space is vacant. It's that simple from what many would be tenants have said. He scares business people away who WOULD otherwise pay his inflated prices. So the reality there is not even so much about the rental rates, it is about him, personally. Business people all talk and many know how sour he is to deal with and simply wont, at any price take space there. Well maybe they'd take space for free. At this point, with his reputation SO well known, he would have to discount the space fairly steeply to attract anyone at this point because his reputation is so well known as a caustic, toxic person, that business people simply cannot have that kind of property manager in their business plan - at any price. Running a business is complicated, & risky enough without adding to it the uncertainty and legal expense of a landlord who is unpredictable and sour to work with. Property owners should add value to their tenant's businesses by making it very easy to do business in a space.
Rira
1:19 pm on Sunday, March 6, 2011
When a tenant says 'jump' (reasonably) a good landlord who sees him/herself as adding value to their tenant's business should be eager to say "how high?!!" From 'word on the street' he made doing business very difficult for many entrepreneurs over the years and they all left - never looking back - and a few of them are thriving elsewhere - such as Rhythm & Muse/Los Gatos, and of course Bella Luna / Milky Way !
Bob from JP
11:35 am on Sunday, March 6, 2011
Unaffordable for who? Bella Luna, who had been paying below market rates for years?
If you own a building, you can charge whatever rates you want, because YOU OWN IT. Business decisions aren't made for benevolence - they are made to make money. Capitalism, you may have heard of it......
danielle
1:39 pm on Sunday, March 6, 2011
I live between Hyde Square and Jackson Square, and I don't support Whole Foods moving in. I feel that it will increase traffic exponentially, and this is right on the path that we walk our kids to school and back every day (which, Canary Square is already a difficult place to cross with kids). I don't support Whole Foods as a business either. I just feel that they are nothing more than an upscale Walmart. I'm not a white hipster. I care about healthy food, but I also care about the Whole Foods affect. I also really care about the amount of on-line flaming, and it saddens me.
Michael
10:38 am on Monday, March 7, 2011
No one called you on it. hmmm.
Whole Foods an "upscale WalMart"? That comparing rotten apples to organic oranges.
There are so many differences I'm not even sure where to begin. It's unsupported/unsupportable statements like that that demonstrate the lack of logic at play in the opposition to WFM.
danielle
1:05 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
Thanks for writing me off as showing a demonstrated lack of logic, rather than listening to my opinion as a neighbor. Did you have any opinions regarding the increased traffic for families walking their kids to school?
I'd say that I am actually comparing rotten pesticide apples to 365 brand fake 'organic' apples from China (Much of the 365 brand or affordable 'organic' produce actually comes from China, whose regulations on organic does not mean the same thing as here).
I'm not the first person to compare Whole Foods to Walmart: http://www.alternet.org/environment/142229/whole_foods_looks_and_acts_more_like_wal-mart_than_a_'sustainable'_natural_foods_store/?page=entire
This letter written by Michael Pollan also has some excellent points regarding Whole Foods and I share many of his opinions on this topic:
http://michaelpollan.com/articles-archive/my-letter-to-whole-foods/
danielle
1:28 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
Okay, in the spirit of fairness and that I don't think a lot of sources are solid enough on the 365 brand, so I will retract my apples and '365 organic' statement. I personally won't be buying them regardless, I'll be searching for local Massachusetts apples.
Michael
1:43 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
Interesting reads. It appears the author of the alterNet article boycotted WFM before shopping there and seeing how much locally grown produce they actually carry. Naturally it's up to the consumer to chose to purchase or not the raspberries from Chile in December, or
The letter by Michael Pollan (while perhaps a bit irrelevant having been authored 5 years ago) is on a whole quite positive in it's assessment of WFM and it's stated aim of local sourcing, and the ability of a large retailer to remake the landscape of sustainable produce and meats. Did you read it?
Or, as appears is possible, you Googled "'Whole Foods' Walmart" and mistook the single paragraph in his letter as a criticism of WFM, when in fact it states that Walmart routinely sources it organic produce from China. Not Whole Foods. You may wish to re-read his letter. It is indeed excellent...
As regards traffic patterns in Hyde Square, who is to say? You're employing conjecture as predictive of future patterns. Anything is possible.
I hope you've signed up for your farm share from Red Fire Farm, and ride your bicycle to pick it up. As a working artist I can't afford one, but perhaps we'll pass on the bikeway, or buying seeds for our backyard gardens at Allendale?
danielle
2:03 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
Ouch. I'm familiar with the whole letter written by Michael Pollan in its entirety. Can you help me understand how I said his article was supporting the comparison between Whole Foods and Walmart? I thought I said something along the lines of 'I also share many of the opinions in this letter'. I ultimately believe that Whole Foods has some inherent issues, as any huge company, and this has implications with the core beliefs of the organic movement. Also, while they have signage that states 'shop local produce', etc, most of their items are not local.
Michael
2:21 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
Since I don't believe there was anything in the AlterNet article regarding WFM sourcing from China, but rather just invoking the opinion that WFM was like Walmart, I presume your mis-read about WFM sourcing from China was erroneously gleaned from the Pollen letter. Especially since you cited both in rebuttal to my assertion that WFM is hardly like Walmart. Naturally folks are entitled to opinion, but facts are more solid in debate.
Until I lost my job in Allston, I drove one day a week specifically to shop at the WFM on Washington Street. There were many choices of produce from local sources, as well as those further afield. More often than not, I would pass on produce not sourced in our region, if not locally, and for that matter, would always opt for the organic over the conventional when presented with a choice. Walking to Harvest for food since September, I have far fewer choices across the board. I welcome the expanded options a WFM in our neighborhood would offer. Folks are certainly free not to explore all the options available to them. But why?
danielle
3:16 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
Ouch again. You presumed incorrectly. And I wasn't looking for a debate, I was only trying to share my opinion as a neighbor in all of this. Which was why my statement started with 'I feel'. I didn't realize that these were debate threads. I'm glad for you that you feel you will have more choices. I will be voting with my dollars elsewhere.
patty
10:28 pm on Sunday, March 6, 2011
Hello Rira
Thanks for your words. I would be delighted to go to another community meeting to speak but frankly libraries concern me more. How in H**l could I have gotten an acedemic scholarship as a poor kid from Bromley Heath without access to a library? I have stated that English is not my native language but neither is Spanish and gee whiz I speak that too. Does that make me smarter than anyone else......heck no but it shows that I took advantage of EVERY opportunity afforded me and my family and while I had subsidized school lunch, food stamps, clothes from Salvation Army, the previous equivilant of Masshealth and Globe Santa, my mom made sure that her kids were successful and believe me as a kid, mom was the boss.... and guess wha..t she sure made sure we took advantage of our FREE AMERICAN EDUCATIONAL SYSTEM....For kids from the projects we are a clinical social worker (me), a retired colonel in the Marine Corps and a Human Resource Expert for the federal government.
Let me know where and when, at the next community meeting I can testify as a "true Jamaica Plain native". I will be happy to bring another perspective....just as I have to our "save our library meetings" and both Jeff Sanchez and Felix Jr. sure have heard me speak. Forget the grocery store and save the libraries.....isn't intellectual advantage more important?
Rira
2:38 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
Patty,
I would start by simply cutting/pasting your comments from here to the 'whose foods' face books pages and be super clear that you are 50 year resident of Hyde Jackson and ask who are the 'whose fooders' to speak for you? The nerve. The audacity.
Then e mail your story to Sanchez, Arroyo, Menino, O'Malley and Chang Diaz, then calling their offices to be sure they received them.
AND call Whole Foods to tell them you support them coming here - they need to hear the support - they are certainly hearing the oppostion, they need to hear the balanced other side that supports them coming to JP, so call them - from the face book page the contact is Heather McCready 617,492,5500ext3008
David Hannon
3:53 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
Patty, I am truly inspired by your story, and welcome your eloquently stated points of view. Hope to meet you some day. Best, David
wymania
6:24 am on Monday, March 7, 2011
hopefully the "whole foods effect" extends to the cleanliness of the neighborhood as well. hyde square is dirty.
gretchen van ness
9:14 am on Monday, March 7, 2011
Other cities and states are spending millions of dollars to bring grocery stores like Whole Foods to neighborhoods like Hyde Square:
http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2011/03/07/shortage_of_grocers_plagues_mass_cities/?p1=News_links
We are extremely lucky that a private company has decided to bring so many jobs to JP, as well as exactly the kinds of foods identified as lacking in most urban neighborhoods in Massachusetts. But as this article suggests, even with a Whole Foods in JP, we will still be underserved. I look forward to the Hyde and Jackson Square developments becoming an ethnic food mecca for JP and beyond!
patty
4:18 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
Thanks David. Let's plan to meet at Whole foods when it opens. Hopefully they can start construction soon.
Patty
anon
4:30 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
If rising property values are a bad thing, are falling property values a good thing? And if so, should we do everything we can to make neighborhoods less desirable places to live?
Rira
10:20 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
Yes absolutely. Quick, tell the city to cancel the spring street cleaning, stop collecting trash weekly, go to once a month trash collection, add graffitti to all buildings, close libraries, close subway lines, no more youth jobs, create potholes, turn off street lights, close all public parks - help me out guys how else can we lower property values? We must make the whose fooders happy!
jljp
4:32 pm on Monday, March 7, 2011
I've just joined a great new site petitioning a welcoming JP for ALL of us who live and work here! You may want to check it out: www.jpforall.org
kathy griffin
10:35 am on Thursday, March 10, 2011
Hi-Lo was a movie theatre in the 1930s and 1940s. Should we revert to that? El Oriental de Cuba was a German bakery in 1900. Should we revert to that? Spontaneous Celebrations was the German Club up to ca. 1987. Should we revert to that? Southgate Pharmacy was on the corner of Moraine and Huntington. Should we revert to that? Flanagan's was next to it (now CVS). Does anyone really miss Flanagan's? The out-of-date meat products? Come on, guys. Change happens.
John Stephen Dwyer
6:00 pm on Thursday, March 10, 2011
I have lived in Jamaica Plain off-and-on since 1967 and, obviously, I have seen more changes than I can count. All of them were opposed (sometimes violently) by someone. Ultimately, all have been widely accepted and contribute to the character of JP in the 21st Century.
We should be uncomfortable with the assumption that anything viewed as “a threat to the current neighborhood” should be resisted. Wouldn't it be wrong to (for example) oppose the creation of a Hispanic supermarket in a mostly Irish-American section of West Roxbury on the grounds that it would change the character of the community and possibly change housing values?
In the area of Hyde Square, some of the people who benefit from increasing property values are part of the same Spanish-speaking population people are trying to “protect.” No matter what your ethnic background, how would you feel to learn that someone was actively engaged in a campaign to stop the value of your property from increasing? While gentrification has a downside, the ghetto-izatio of JP's Hispanophone community has a downside as well. Let's be careful what we wish for.
We are all entitled to opinions, and here's mine: Without us having a strong, feasible and promptly-implementable alternative to Whole Food's arrival, actively opposing it is deeply misguided.
David Hannon
6:21 pm on Thursday, March 10, 2011
Well stated John. Thanks for being a thoughful voice in this discussion.
geffe
12:03 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
So the folks who own property around Hyde Square might see the values go up because of Whole Pay Check moving in. JP already has two overly priced markets, Harvest, which is dirty and smells bad, and City Feed & Supply which is so over priced it's a joke. And yet they are filled with folks buying stuff. WF offers some good products for decent prices and while I'm not inclined to shop there myself I don't see why this would not be a good thing. If anything it would put Harvest on notice to clean up their act.
Bob from JP
2:38 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
I wonder if the Whole Foods opponents have actually ever been to a whole foods store? I went to the Dedham whole foods to refresh my memory of what they have to offer.
I did a full shopping trip, with some extras that I normally would not buy (the great free samples they offer did me in), and ended up spending a grand total of $10-$15 more than my usual amount at Super 88 and Super Stop&Shop in Dorchester. (Household composed of 2 people and 2 very hungry, organic vegetable-enjoying rabbits.)
Mind you, this was buying organic produce vs. the non-organic stuff I usually purchase for dirt cheap at Super 88.
Let's say $15 is the difference per week. Annualize that and you get approximately $800 per year to eat non-chemically treated, healthier produce. If you ask me, that's not a high price to pay.
If I did not purchase organic, there essentially would be no delta between my typical shopping trips and Whole Foods. So this "Whole Paycheck" thing is preposterous in my opinion - sure, if you are buying all of the niche gourmet products they offer, you can rack up a large grocery bill in a hurry - but if you're looking for some staples and fresh produce, you are not paying much (if anything) more than you would elsewhere.
Besides, if it pains you so much to be around all the "yuppies" at WF, just go to the Stop & Shop down the street.
geffe
3:13 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
Lighten up, it's a joke moniker used by a lot of people. By the way for some $15 a week more in produce is more than they can afford.
You feed your rabbits organic produce, enough said.
Most of what they sell a WF is pretty expensive. So is Harvest and most of the other markets in the area.
I don't really care if they move into JP myself. They are not known for being very good to the staff, and are very anti-union. But hey I don't work there. They are known to make people work ridiculous hours and then fire them before the benefits kick in.
Bob from JP
3:36 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
The "joke moniker" has been tossed around by WF critics in JP as being a fact, which it is not. Many people will just accept it without actually going to the store and seeing the prices for themselves.
To your earlier point, the food at City Feed is far and away more expensive than WF, and yet no one is complaining about that. Why don't we replace City Feed with a Bodega with low cost Latino and Caribbean foods? (I do love the fact that if a business is not a corporation, it is exempt from the same criticism as a big company receives)
I understand $15 a week for some is not feasible - that's why Stop & Shop is available down the street, which offers somewhat lower prices than WF.
As far as feeding my rabbits organic vegetables, if I've worked hard enough to be able to do it, why shouldn't I? A 5 lb rabbit's tolerance for chemicals present in non-organic food is far less than a human being's.
Your rabbit comment brings me to my underlying point - the theme implicit in all of these discussions is that those that are not in the working class should somehow feel guilty about it. What ever happenned to working your way up to something better and enjoying the fruits (and vegetables) of your labor?
Why should "middle to upper class" resident of JP be deprived from having access to a local Whole Foods? Because they are not economically disadvantaged, their concerns don't matter as much?
geffe
3:49 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
Oh poor you. No Whole Foods for you and your wabbit. Are you serious?
Personally I've only been in City Feed once and walked out after seeing that one would need a second mortgage to shop there. By the way, that's a joke. I shop at WF in Dedham myself and as I said I don't have any issues with WF opening a store in JP. Mind you I only go there maybe once every three months.
Are you aware of how absurd you sound? Playing up class distinctions? I'm not working class myself but I would put this into an argument on a public forum. It is in poor taste to wear ones accomplishments or financial luck on their sleeves. Really bad form. Just not cricket as they say.
Bob from JP
4:02 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
I think you're dead wrong. "Financial Luck" has little, if anything to do with it. Why is it that if someone is successful, financially or otherwise, they are deemed "lucky". It marginalizes the hard work that goes into it and suggests that the only explanation for poverty is having been "unlucky". Preposterous.
If you're poor, you can cry on the mountain tops about your plight all day long, but if you're not, God forbid you voice your opinion and don't bury your achievements.
As I tried to convey, in my opinion, this is not about Whole Foods. In truth, I could care less if Whole Foods comes to JP or not - my yuppie self has been just fine eating non-organic produce for the entirety of my life, and will continue to be fine if by some cataclysmic event, WF does not follow through in JP.
What I resent is the demonization of people that are "well off" by these protesters. It's one thing to advocate for the rights of citizens in the community - it's another thing entirely to try to explicitly exclude a different demographic from moving in.
But hey, I think Betsaida Guiterrez summed it up best, "JP is for us, not for the rich people".
geffe
5:19 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
Luck does have something to do with as does hard work. I don't care how well off you are.
I know some people who have been laid off and are worse off now than say five years ago.
That's bad luck pal.
You seem to have bad manners or are coming across that way.
It's in bad taste to go around telling people how well off you are.
I'm not excluding anyone and as I stated I don't care if WF moves in to JP or not.
By the way when you're finished digging that hole can I have my shovel back.
Jonathan
4:20 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
This leaves me wondering if Betsaida Guiterrez would move out of JP if her income increased, and if she encourages others to leave as their salaries grow? Or is she just a bigot and means only non-minority 'rich' people? A clarification from her would be nice.
As far as it being in poor taste to wear one's accomplishments or financial luck on their sleeves, unless I'm misunderstanding the statement, are you saying a financially successful person shouldn't purchase nice cars/clothes/etc because that is flaunting their wealth? To take it to another extreme, abolish 'honor roll' in schools because that's flaunting your success in front of other students who aren't doing as well. That statement sounds borderline communist, which is fine if that's the political viewpoint you're trying to espouse. Please correct me if I have misunderstood your comment because it sounds so absurd I'm sure I have it wrong.
geffe
5:28 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
yeah you have it wrong. It's in bad taste in conversation to flaunt ones wealth. You get it.
To equate this with success at school is absurd. Mind you when my kid made honor roll I was not one of those parents who put one of those dumb bumper stickers on my car. So you see it's about class, having it I mean. The statement is about not having the good sense to know when to show ones wealth and when to be subtle about it. Being that this forum is about class and wealth I should think people who are better off should use some discretion on how they approach the subject. There use to be a time when talking about money was considered such a lower middle class thing to do. Interesting how that has changed.
Bob from JP
5:59 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
Geffe, great deflection of the actual underlying issues raised and regurgitation of what you have already stated multiple times, but I'll humor you for the sake of discourse.....
Your contention is that I "flaunted" my "wealth" by noting that my rabbits enjoyed eating organic produce, is that correct? Would you have been happier with my manners if I indicated that I was too poor to feed my rabbits anything but scraps from the table?
Do you know people who feed their dogs organic dog food? Do you assume they are flaunting their wealth when they do so?
geffe
8:27 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
So what you're doing is not regurgitation. Oh boy. Talk about self importance.
I was not referring to your rabbits and your predilection to feed them organic lettuce.
I happen to own a dog who eats regular dog food and table scraps. He's not picky and very healthy. I'm not a obsessive compulsive pet owner.
You were flaunting the fact that you have money and that your a yuppy who wants Whole Foods to move into JP. That's rude in my book pal. Like I said getting back to the topic at hand I do not care if WF moves into JP or not. When I first moved to JP over 12 years ago it was affordable and a very diverse community. That's going away fast. It's becoming more like Brookline every year. Which is too bad in my view. I live in Hyde Park now, which is that poorer neighborhood next door. It's not as trendy as JP so it's avoided a lot of the issue JP has. I shop in JP sometimes on the way home from work. I still get my haircuts at Sals.
I still go to some of the watering holes in JP as well. In my view the over gentrification of JP is more about a type of person more than money. You get my drift. They will also close down most of the local bakeries and other small shops that sell food. That's a given. On the other hand I know some farmers in Vermont who love WF. They sell all their produce to them. So for them it will be a good for business.
I never said anything about poor or working class folks.
Bob from JP
8:56 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
No one flaunted anything, so I'm not sure why you are still harping on manners..... I'm also a bit mystified regarding why expressing a desire for Whole Foods to come to JP is rude, but ok.
In any case, this has veered completely off topic and I'm sure everyone is sick of reading about it, so let's cease our mutual regurgitations and move on.
Maura
10:39 pm on Monday, March 14, 2011
good god. thank you JP.
Loay
2:03 pm on Monday, May 2, 2011
Having shopped at the Whole Foods on P street in DC, and as a home owner in Hyde Square, I fully agree with this beautifully reasoned and written article .
Anne Mackin
1:50 pm on Sunday, May 8, 2011
This is a masterful piece of journalism, using hearsay, well-selected quotes, and a few selective statistics to make a powerful case demonizing Whole Foods. I've looked at the sources referred to in this article and they are sloppily applied. For example, the radio-piece referred to on Washington's P Street neighborhood articulated many benefits of the gentrification there. That article attempted to be fair, which this letter does not.
As a former urban planner, and former senior planner for the Commonwealth for two years, I can attest that Gentrification is a complex process. For example, JP will not be able to prevent the arrival of young professionals here as the Medical Area continues to grow (and the Medical Area growth is one of the factors that prevents the recession from hitting Boston and Massachusetts even harder than it has).
There are both pros and cons to the arrival of Whole Foods. One of the benefits could be jobs for our Latino neighbors. (Boston Latinos have the highest rate of unemployment in the state.) The JPNC and City of Boston need to work to protect vulnerable JP residents from the rising rents and costs of living that can come with gentrification, as this letter suggests, but with real insight and understanding rather than the hysteria that surrounds this issue.
Anne Mackin (JP resident for 21 years)
Maura
10:47 pm on Sunday, May 8, 2011
Bless you Anne.
Jen
5:37 pm on Thursday, January 12, 2012
homefries, bless you for putting yourself out there with this piece. man are people mean.
Bob from JP
9:40 pm on Thursday, January 12, 2012
Yeah homefries, thanks for putting together an op-ed entirely composed of conjecture, vague anecdotal references and over-reaching assumptions. Real gem.
And thank you Jen for re-hashing this months after the fact. Bravo!
Cliff
9:42 pm on Thursday, January 12, 2012
game over, really...
patty
7:01 am on Friday, January 13, 2012
Jen
Have you been out of the country? This article is 10 months old. The store has opened and people are shopping there. If you and others do not want to shop there then there are other options in the neighborhood. I thought we had finally put all this nonsense to rest. There are other issues...for example the MBTA wants to raise fares outrageously. We will all be afected by that so protesters why don't you come out to the Hennigan school on Feb 6 at 6 pm to raise your voices in protest. A grocery is not hurting our neighborhood but T fares at the dounble the price will have a far greater effect on jobs and our neighbors. I will be there because I take the T and the suggested changes are ridiculous!! Protest this NOT a store that is open and frequented by the neighborhood.
Patty